1
Learning Java for Java, not Minecraft specifically.
Xero -
ShadowCatEXE
Although this has probably been discussed before, I'd like to rant, again.
So after browsing the forums, I've noticed most kids have been inspired to "learn" Java because of Minecraft. This goes without them knowing basic semantics in programming, and I bet most of couldn't define what type of language Java is! So, in this post I'd like to clean some stuff up for kids that want to work with programming.
Learning Programming Semantics
Although the basic semantics of a object orientated language is pretty easy to understand. it's still good to have when you're using it pretty much every single line. So before jumping right into a world of Minecraft Modding, you should ask yourself if you really know how to use Java, even the very basics (I'm talking, old school command-line programming basics, here). These will be essential for creating good and stable mods. Because how are you supposed to create a mod in Java, if you don't know how to use Java itself?
Understand what Java Actually is
Java is much bigger than just Minecraft is what I hope most people realize. Java is not only a programming language, but it's also a platform that can work multi-os (Meaning, it will work on not only Windows, but Mac os and a whole bunch of Linux distros too). Despite the fact that the platform itself is awesome, but also looking at the programming language, it's awesome too! Java is known as a "object orientated programming language" this means data can be saved in things known as "classes", and be represented as objects, with accessible properties that have data. Since Java is a huge topic, it cannot all be discussed here. But i'd advise you read the official Java Documentation / Tutorials provided by 0racle.
Inspiration
Thanks to Zlb01 for bringing up the topic of "Inspiration". I'm not trying to discourage Minecraft inspiring you to work with Java. But this does not imply that you should start out with Minecraft mods, and still, if you start out with basics, you will end up being even better when you reach the point of making a Minecraft mod. You will be able to understand it, and grapple it better. Therefor having a solid complete goal, instead of jumping to your goal.
Now what?
Now that I've given you some official sources, read them, learn from them, and forget all about Minecraft when you are reading them.
Learn Java for Java, and not Java for Minecraft.
Sources / Extra
Oracle: http://oracle.com/
Java Tutorial (by Oracle): http://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/
Java Docs (by Oracle): http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/
Object-oriented programming (Wikipedia): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-or ... g_language
Thanks for anyone who took the time too read this, please don't hesitate to post your opinions below. You can also help correct me if there is an error in the post.
Thanks again,
Xero
So after browsing the forums, I've noticed most kids have been inspired to "learn" Java because of Minecraft. This goes without them knowing basic semantics in programming, and I bet most of couldn't define what type of language Java is! So, in this post I'd like to clean some stuff up for kids that want to work with programming.
Learning Programming Semantics
Although the basic semantics of a object orientated language is pretty easy to understand. it's still good to have when you're using it pretty much every single line. So before jumping right into a world of Minecraft Modding, you should ask yourself if you really know how to use Java, even the very basics (I'm talking, old school command-line programming basics, here). These will be essential for creating good and stable mods. Because how are you supposed to create a mod in Java, if you don't know how to use Java itself?
Understand what Java Actually is
Java is much bigger than just Minecraft is what I hope most people realize. Java is not only a programming language, but it's also a platform that can work multi-os (Meaning, it will work on not only Windows, but Mac os and a whole bunch of Linux distros too). Despite the fact that the platform itself is awesome, but also looking at the programming language, it's awesome too! Java is known as a "object orientated programming language" this means data can be saved in things known as "classes", and be represented as objects, with accessible properties that have data. Since Java is a huge topic, it cannot all be discussed here. But i'd advise you read the official Java Documentation / Tutorials provided by 0racle.
Inspiration
Thanks to Zlb01 for bringing up the topic of "Inspiration". I'm not trying to discourage Minecraft inspiring you to work with Java. But this does not imply that you should start out with Minecraft mods, and still, if you start out with basics, you will end up being even better when you reach the point of making a Minecraft mod. You will be able to understand it, and grapple it better. Therefor having a solid complete goal, instead of jumping to your goal.
Now what?
Now that I've given you some official sources, read them, learn from them, and forget all about Minecraft when you are reading them.
Learn Java for Java, and not Java for Minecraft.
Sources / Extra
Oracle: http://oracle.com/
Java Tutorial (by Oracle): http://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/
Java Docs (by Oracle): http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/
Object-oriented programming (Wikipedia): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-or ... g_language
Thanks for anyone who took the time too read this, please don't hesitate to post your opinions below. You can also help correct me if there is an error in the post.
Thanks again,
Xero
Create an account or sign in to comment.
32
1
Java is SOO Easy!!
1. Pour water in a kettle and boil it.
2. Take the coffee and...
Nah just joking. many people these days make the mistake of just jumping into coding thinking that they can just watch a couple of youtube vids and get the hang of it that way. What's worse is that they give up in a day saying "it's boring".
Some people make epic builds, some make amazing texturepacks and some make complicated mods. What ever people do, you can't become a master by watching a few videos.
1. Pour water in a kettle and boil it.
2. Take the coffee and...
Nah just joking. many people these days make the mistake of just jumping into coding thinking that they can just watch a couple of youtube vids and get the hang of it that way. What's worse is that they give up in a day saying "it's boring".
Some people make epic builds, some make amazing texturepacks and some make complicated mods. What ever people do, you can't become a master by watching a few videos.
1
Which is what I did. I just jumped right into it (Obvious mistake). I don't plan to become some master coder though, but I do like it as a hobby and do try and learn mot things on my own. I plan to do something much more exciting in life.
1
Bump.
1
Xero -Although this has probably been discussed before, I'd like to rant, again.
So after browsing the forums, I've noticed most kids have been inspired to "learn" Java because of Minecraft. This goes without them knowing basic semantics in programming, and I bet most of couldn't define what type of language Java is! So, in this post I'd like to clean some stuff up for kids that want to work with programming.
Learning Programming Semantics
Although the basic semantics of a object orientated language is pretty easy to understand. it's still good to have when you're using it pretty much every single line. So before jumping right into a world of Minecraft Modding, you should ask yourself if you really know how to use Java, even the very basics (I'm talking, old school command-line programming basics, here). These will be essential for creating good and stable mods. Because how are you supposed to create a mod in Java, if you don't know how to use Java itself?
Understand what Java Actually is
Java is much bigger than just Minecraft is what I hope most people realize. Java is not only a programming language, but it's also a platform that can work multi-os (Meaning, it will work on not only Windows, but Mac os and a whole bunch of Linux distros too). Despite the fact that the platform itself is awesome, but also looking at the programming language, it's awesome too! Java is known as a "object orientated programming language" this means data can be saved in things known as "classes", and be represented as objects, with accessible properties that have data. Since Java is a huge topic, it cannot all be discussed here. But i'd advise you read the official Java Documentation / Tutorials provided by 0racle.
Inspiration
Thanks to Zlb01 for bringing up the topic of "Inspiration". I'm not trying to discourage Minecraft inspiring you to work with Java. But this does not imply that you should start out with Minecraft mods, and still, if you start out with basics, you will end up being even better when you reach the point of making a Minecraft mod. You will be able to understand it, and grapple it better. Therefor having a solid complete goal, instead of jumping to your goal.
Now what?
Now that I've given you some official sources, read them, learn from them, and forget all about Minecraft when you are reading them.
Learn Java for Java, and not Java for Minecraft.
Sources / Extra
Oracle: http://oracle.com/
Java Tutorial (by Oracle): http://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/
Java Docs (by Oracle): http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/
Object-oriented programming (Wikipedia): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-or ... g_language
Thanks for anyone who took the time too read this, please don't hesitate to post your opinions below. You can also help correct me if there is an error in the post.
Thanks again,
Xero
Yeah they think that java scripting is something you can learn in 1 minute lol
1
I like the sound of this. I can easily relate it to my own experience so far; I have tried to mod in Java for the sake of MC, but just found it floundering. All the func_55345 stuff is confusing and I just can't continue until I learn Java on its own. Thanks for the pointers.
1
Well, I think I've drained this place of people interested enough to read and reply. :p
1
Unfortunately, there probably aren't a lot of people on this forum
who would agree with your points and understand how programming languages/libraries should be learned, but a thread like this is very useful for people who are willing to stop being lazy and listen to good advice.
who would agree with your points and understand how programming languages/libraries should be learned, but a thread like this is very useful for people who are willing to stop being lazy and listen to good advice.
1
bumb
1
Bump
1
As a Java developer here, you get a +1 from me. Jolly good explanation. I'm now going to do an absolutely idiotic thing by saying that I can give tutorials to Java to anyone who would like. Just message me on my Skype and say you're from PMC.
1
Thanks!
1
[deleted]
1
This is true in some cases, but languages can have varying syntax. Like there is the "two space" / "two step" syntax, which is basically almost without brackets and uses 2 spaces to represent scoping and such.
This was also remarked under the "Learning Programming Semantics", so thanks for giving a nice valid opinion. I too agree with you.
This was also remarked under the "Learning Programming Semantics", so thanks for giving a nice valid opinion. I too agree with you.
1
Having someone there in person to help you learn is a lot different from watching a tutorial, and copying what they are doing. If you really want to learn your first language, then I would seriously recommend that you enroll in some sort of instructional class.
It really makes all the difference!
It really makes all the difference!
1
This can be true in some cases, as I've helped a lot of my friends IRL with web-related programming. But it really depends on the instructor. You can have a bad teacher, it's just the luck of the enrollment I suppose. You have to be at the right place at the right time (which isn't very hard, in this case).
Which brings me to a point that wanting to succeed I always found I was better off doing it myself, so I could work at my own pace. I also like learning myself because I can refer back to documents I previously read if I ever get confused, or if I need to refresh my memory. This is why I originally link the official Oracle Java documents and tutorial.
Thanks for your opinion!
Which brings me to a point that wanting to succeed I always found I was better off doing it myself, so I could work at my own pace. I also like learning myself because I can refer back to documents I previously read if I ever get confused, or if I need to refresh my memory. This is why I originally link the official Oracle Java documents and tutorial.
Thanks for your opinion!
1
You are right when you say it depends on the instructor. The class I took we all got to work at our own pace, and she just provided notes, and programs that we needed to code. If you needed any help you could just ask her, and she would come over and help you. In retrospect it was a little bit ineffective for the slower learners in the course, but for me it was perfect.
1
Sounds like a good method, hope you did well.
1
SunrisebearXero --snip, lots of text-
I don't know if I'm the only one, but minecraft actually taught me my first dose of java!
Also, if you could keep from quoting the post that'd be good, it's quite large and it looks kinda spammy.
1
Sunrisebear
I don't know if I'm the only one, but minecraft actually taught me my first dose of java!
That kinda defies of what most of this post says, although since you didn't give the most in-depth response, I'm going to assume that you continued to learn Java based off official sources, and not Minecraft.
Anyways, best of luck with Java, and such.
1
Xero -Although this has probably been discussed before, I'd like to rant, again.
So after browsing the forums, I've noticed most kids have been inspired to "learn" Java because of Minecraft. This goes without them knowing basic semantics in programming, and I bet most of couldn't define what type of language Java is! So, in this post I'd like to clean some stuff up for kids that want to work with programming.
Learning Programming Semantics
Although the basic semantics of a object orientated language is pretty easy to understand. it's still good to have when you're using it pretty much every single line. So before jumping right into a world of Minecraft Modding, you should ask yourself if you really know how to use Java, even the very basics (I'm talking, old school command-line programming basics, here). These will be essential for creating good and stable mods. Because how are you supposed to create a mod in Java, if you don't know how to use Java itself?
Understand what Java Actually is
Java is much bigger than just Minecraft is what I hope most people realize. Java is not only a programming language, but it's also a platform that can work multi-os (Meaning, it will work on not only Windows, but Mac os and a whole bunch of Linux distros too). Despite the fact that the platform itself is awesome, but also looking at the programming language, it's awesome too! Java is known as a "object orientated programming language" this means data can be saved in things known as "classes", and be represented as objects, with accessible properties that have data. Since Java is a huge topic, it cannot all be discussed here. But i'd advise you read the official Java Documentation / Tutorials provided by 0racle.
Inspiration
Thanks to Zlb01 for bringing up the topic of "Inspiration". I'm not trying to discourage Minecraft inspiring you to work with Java. But this does not imply that you should start out with Minecraft mods, and still, if you start out with basics, you will end up being even better when you reach the point of making a Minecraft mod. You will be able to understand it, and grapple it better. Therefor having a solid complete goal, instead of jumping to your goal.
Now what?
Now that I've given you some official sources, read them, learn from them, and forget all about Minecraft when you are reading them.
Learn Java for Java, and not Java for Minecraft.
Sources / Extra
Oracle: http://oracle.com/
Java Tutorial (by Oracle): http://docs.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/
Java Docs (by Oracle): http://docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/
Object-oriented programming (Wikipedia): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-or ... g_language
Thanks for anyone who took the time too read this, please don't hesitate to post your opinions below. You can also help correct me if there is an error in the post.
Thanks again,
Xero
I don't know if I'm the only one, but minecraft actually taught me my first dose of java!
1
I like this guy (or girl).. I made the mistake a long time ago by jumping right into coding mods. I had no idea how to code Java, and I though "Yeah, there's tutorials.. I'll just copy from there and make multiple's of the same type of thing to make it seem cool". Worst idea ever.
I started, and all I did was add a few items/blocks. Then I went a long and messed EVERYTHING up. Got a whole bunch load of errors I didn't know how to fix all because I didn't learn the language first. I got frustrated and gave up for about a few months, then went back to try to fix it. (Going over the tutorials again, deleting and redoing the code..etc)
Then it came to me.. "Why don't I just look for tutorials?" but even that was hard, because the tutorials showed most of the things I was doing in making the mods. So I skipped most of the tutorials, and later on, I didn't know how to do most of the things the newer tutorials were teaching.
But now, I've been looking everywhere at tutorials, learning, and using that knowledge to make good and decent things. I now love coding, and have selected a programming class in my high school so I can learn a whole bunch more.
For people who want to learn how to make plugins/mods, I suggest fallowing Xero's advice and look up the tutorials supported by Oracle. ^.^
I started, and all I did was add a few items/blocks. Then I went a long and messed EVERYTHING up. Got a whole bunch load of errors I didn't know how to fix all because I didn't learn the language first. I got frustrated and gave up for about a few months, then went back to try to fix it. (Going over the tutorials again, deleting and redoing the code..etc)
Then it came to me.. "Why don't I just look for tutorials?" but even that was hard, because the tutorials showed most of the things I was doing in making the mods. So I skipped most of the tutorials, and later on, I didn't know how to do most of the things the newer tutorials were teaching.
But now, I've been looking everywhere at tutorials, learning, and using that knowledge to make good and decent things. I now love coding, and have selected a programming class in my high school so I can learn a whole bunch more.
For people who want to learn how to make plugins/mods, I suggest fallowing Xero's advice and look up the tutorials supported by Oracle. ^.^
1
That's great, best of luck to you.
1
Bump
1
To anyone that's coming down along this post, it's not meant to stop you from making mods, it just some advice to people that might want to start making mods.
1
Minecraft modding originally got me interested in code. I haven't touched any yet, but the college I'll be attending has an abundance of computer science courses and I can't wait to take some.
While I know nothing about Java currently, as someone who took a language in high school I can still agree with you here. Learning specific sentences in a language before learning basic syntax damages your ability to learn the language as a whole.
While I know nothing about Java currently, as someone who took a language in high school I can still agree with you here. Learning specific sentences in a language before learning basic syntax damages your ability to learn the language as a whole.
1
Zlb01Xero -"oh look, this game was made in Java, I guess I will just mod it cluelessly".
Lol, people do do that sometimes, and yes you do need to have the passion to not just mod minecraft but learn all about java and become a java coder, yes some people do just learn code to minecraft but they don't know what possibilities that come from java, you can do a whole ton of things, and not just code minecraft
Yes, and that's exactly the point of my post, thanks for understanding.
1
Xero -"oh look, this game was made in Java, I guess I will just mod it cluelessly".
Lol, people do do that sometimes, and yes you do need to have the passion to not just mod minecraft but learn all about java and become a java coder, yes some people do just learn code to minecraft but they don't know what possibilities that come from java, you can do a whole ton of things, and not just code minecraft
1
That C++ vs C meme post honestly made me "lol", nice find.
Also thanks for agreeing with my case, I've always sought that the best inspiration came from wanting to learn for the joy of learning it and not because "oh look, this game was made in Java, I guess I will just mod it cluelessly".
Also thanks for agreeing with my case, I've always sought that the best inspiration came from wanting to learn for the joy of learning it and not because "oh look, this game was made in Java, I guess I will just mod it cluelessly".
1
Finally someone on this website not recommending that you follow YouTube tutorials for Java that leave out a lot of important information. If you know the language Minecraft's "fake" code is made in, you look at the API (Forge) Javadocs, and stay away from copy/pasting "modding" tutorials.
When you know the language the API is built for, most APIs such as Minecraft modding APIs, 2D game libraries etc. are pretty simple to learn, and unlike modding/programming tutorials saying "you must capitalize classes and constants because I said so", the Javadocs help you see what you're actually doing.
Teaching them how to actually learn the language and succeed 90% of PMC's "programmers" today means OP is referring to them as dumb. Right.
When you know the language the API is built for, most APIs such as Minecraft modding APIs, 2D game libraries etc. are pretty simple to learn, and unlike modding/programming tutorials saying "you must capitalize classes and constants because I said so", the Javadocs help you see what you're actually doing.
Zib01Eventually if they have the passion to keep going they might learn java even more. And maybe even start learning C++ and all the "c" languages
Zib01not all kids are dumb like your trying to state here or as I think your trying to state
Teaching them how to actually learn the language and succeed 90% of PMC's "programmers" today means OP is referring to them as dumb. Right.
1
People get inspired to learn how to program in java from minecraft, if you got inspiration to do something you need to learn it first. There is books you can get at your local library thst can teach you java, such as "Java all in one for dummies" or "heads first java", not all kids are dumb like your trying to state here or as I think your trying to state, some kids in fact most kids know more about computers then their fathers or mothers because they didn't have computers back then.
If you want kids to learn stuff you have to encourage them, it doesn't matter if they make a simple "hello, world" program or a "insta-mine" mod as long as they are learning something.
Eventually if they have the passion to keep going they might learn java even more. And maybe even start learning C++ and all the "c" languages.
Never discourage a child to stop doing what they want to do. And this might be off topic but this is for any child/adult that wants to say bad stuff to children thst are trying to learn.
If you want kids to learn stuff you have to encourage them, it doesn't matter if they make a simple "hello, world" program or a "insta-mine" mod as long as they are learning something.
Eventually if they have the passion to keep going they might learn java even more. And maybe even start learning C++ and all the "c" languages.
Never discourage a child to stop doing what they want to do. And this might be off topic but this is for any child/adult that wants to say bad stuff to children thst are trying to learn.
1
In this post I'm not at all discouraging inspiration at all. I'm implying that you should not take big leaps to you goals. Writing something like a "Hello World!" program can be very different from starting out with making Minecraft mods. This post does discourage the idea of making mods, inspiration, or the idea of Minecraft, it's basically saying "Slow down and start from the beginning".
Edit
I'm also not claiming anyone to be "dumb" in my post, what I was implying is "You're not learning Java thoroughly by just focusing on the Minecraft aspect".
PS
Thanks for your opinion, you're giving me some good stuff to add the the post.
Edit
I'm also not claiming anyone to be "dumb" in my post, what I was implying is "You're not learning Java thoroughly by just focusing on the Minecraft aspect".
PS
Thanks for your opinion, you're giving me some good stuff to add the the post.
1
Learning an API without knowing the language first is the recipe for failure :p
