Minecraft Blogs

My take on the PMC XP system

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avatar Xamboldore
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
64
I must start off by saying this. This is not a rant, this is genuinely what I think about it.

A Basic introduction to the 'issue'

PMC is an absolutely fantastic website. There are all sorts of people. People with different opinions, and therefore contrasting views on this issue. Seeing as others have quite harshly offered there opinions, I shall offer mine, but in a much calmer way.

Much like many debates out there, people just decide to jump onto the bandwagon and say "this is ALWAYS better than that which is COMPLETELY terrible!" The first example that pops into my head is Android vs iOS. No one looks at the facts but everyone likes to argue.
PMC's argument is exactly the same, and here's how.

There are always pros and cons to everything. Sometimes, I'll admit, there are far more pros and less cons on one side of the argument and the complete flip side on the other. However, this is not one of those cases. I'll tell you now, you can't win an argument that is based solely on personal preference.

The Arguments

So, some of the arguments for the PMC XP system.
1) It's a clear way of showing who is creative.
2) It's rewarding
3) It attracts more people onto the site

I completely agree with number 2, partially with number 3 and slightly with number 1. Focusing on #1, here's why:
While it may be true that some people who are creative and work for their level, there are others who spam, steal and work for about five minutes in total for their XP, just because people were feeling kind. Also, someone on the chat said to me that they were 'disappointed' with me for only being Level 10 (at time of writing) after being on the site for so long. They went on to say that your XP level marked off your creativity. They basically said that I was not creative because I have been on the site for a while now and I am still Level 10. Well, this irritated me. The funny thing was that this person was friends with BlackFTW. Now, if you don't know BlackFTW, he is one of the most creative souls in the world, and he is Level 1. He has been on PMC for longer than I have, and he has simply posted things a couple of times, didn't like what he posted and took it down. He has no submissions up (at time of writing) and has Cyprezz as a subscriber. I ask you, how does his level reflect his creativity.
However, I must agree with this point to a certain extent. It is not really true in the first 10 or so levels of PMC. Though it is once we start looking at levels 20 higher. However, I wouldn't connect the amount of time you have been on PMC with the creativity and level, seeing as some people, such as myself, only post when we see fit, and that may be a different period of time for different people.
#2 I agree with. While I don't care about level, I care about recognition. Levelling up means that you have been recognised by a certain amount of people, and that is rewarding.
#3, it can be true, but that honestly doesn't completely favour this side.

Now, let's move onto this opposing side. Three arguments I commonly see:
1) It's a popularity contest.
2) It attracts noobs and ruins the site
3) People post spam for XP

#2 & #3 are a tad bit dramatic. #1 is, however, more accurate than not. You may be someone who people all ready know about or people just tend to like more. You are likely to get more XP because more people will care about your work. This may be deemed unfair, as I have many times, because the quality of the work will be below par and some people will blindly diamond it. This is fine, as long as you diamond work that has obviously had a lot of effort put into it. However, there is nothing wrong with this if there has been some absolutely fantastic work put out there by those individuals.
#2. Of course it attracts 'noobs'! That's what anyone new to the site is! Does that mean it ruins the site? You know where I have heard that? 'I don't want you in my country!' Yep, in racism! I am NOT accusing you of being racist. Nonetheless, look at that and think about how silly that is. Not a single chance is given to the new people!
#3. People may post just for XP, but that's is why there is a very nice, nifty 'Flag' button. Once you flag something, moderators will check it. If they don't like what they see, they remove it, and all XP gained is lost. If they see it as viable for the site, they'll leave it alone, and then you should too.


Conclusions:
There is no winning here. It's preference. I don't live for XP, I don't judge people by their level, but I do like the XP, it's rewarding, and it's a nice way to see that people appreciate your work, even more so when levelling up. I hope this has given you new opinions to consider, and I hope you do. Though, if you want to drag this out, then waste your fun hours on PMC for an argument no one will ever win.

I thank anyone who has actually read through this and thought about what I have said. I must note: the person who said the things that irritated me I do not think any less of. They are entitled to their own opinions, and it may have come across harsher than he wanted it to.

Pleasure,
Xamboldore


Tags

1 Update Logs

Update #1 : 07/17/2012 3:22:48 pmJul 17th, 2012

Basic formatting of the looks to make it more readable.

1
01/24/2013 3:56 pm
Level 8 : Apprentice Network
awj001
I don't want to be xp-ist but I absolutely hate it when level 1 noobs spam the site and don't even post anything. Just comments about 'Sweet! I just got a free Minecraft account at www.fraud.com!'.
1
01/24/2013 3:59 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
This is missing the point. Those people are people who make an account just to post that. That's not really what we should consider a member, so technically not even a Level 1. I see others doing it a lot anyway.
My point is, people shouldn't judge your skill based on what level you are, but on your actual content.
1
08/07/2012 2:46 pm
Level 19 : Journeyman Miner
PlanetPerry
I give you a diamond Xamboldore!
1
07/20/2012 11:42 am
Level 7 : Apprentice Taco
DeathWings
as far as i know you cant get ANY levels without having atleast one submission
1
07/20/2012 2:56 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
You have to submit to gain XP. That is what is said.
1
07/20/2012 3:34 pm
Level 7 : Apprentice Taco
DeathWings
but in the thing it said that someone hadnt submitted anything but had high levels
1
07/20/2012 3:50 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
No, he did submit, but then he removed it. His XP was lost and he went back to Level 1.
1
07/20/2012 11:17 am
Level 11 : Journeyman Mage
bloom50
I don't like to rushed, so I'll level up slowly, putting whatever I make (with effort) onto the site, and hope people like it. Lovely "opinion", but prefer rants. So I'll just think of this as a rant, and give it a diamond. I enjoyed reading it.
1
07/20/2012 8:14 am
Level 27 : Expert Geek
MFN
You now have a stack and a bit of diamonds ^.^
Also, great review of the site's levelling system; I'd never thought about it that way before.
1
07/20/2012 2:58 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Well, I am glad to see this 'enlightened' you. :)
1
07/20/2012 6:45 am
Level 14 : Journeyman Toast
Xistence
Yet more front paging I see. I think it's the X in the name. Just too much awesome XD
1
07/20/2012 2:59 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Yeah, definitely!
1
07/20/2012 2:34 am
Level 28 : Expert Mountaineer
sumo377stucki
I dont like the xp system because If your new (like me) no one looks at your work because they think your a noob.. Like I made a custom terrain and no comments but 155 views and 56 downloads and 1 diamond... I think you should have to comment to download something! anyways great blog!
1
07/20/2012 2:58 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
You are a level 12, people have obviously looked at your stuff.
1
07/19/2012 8:02 pm
Level 17 : Journeyman Dragon
Solar101
Awesome and true!:D
1
07/20/2012 1:12 am
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Thanks!
1
07/19/2012 6:16 pm
Level 49 : Master Technomancer
nyanekomimi
Where did you get the picture, or did you make it yourself?
1
07/19/2012 7:23 pm
Level 26 : Expert Mountaineer
vikingbutch
It's not that hard to make on photoshop, if you're interested.
1
07/19/2012 6:20 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Found the pic on google, then used Pixlr to add the text :)
1
07/19/2012 4:09 pm
Level 38 : Artisan Ninja
Stronghold257
I agree all the way with this.
1
07/19/2012 4:12 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Very nice to (virtually) hear! Thank you!
1
07/19/2012 4:14 pm
Level 38 : Artisan Ninja
Stronghold257
I think that you should only get XP from your work, not posting, uploading, etc. That's rewarding you and showing who people like.
1
07/19/2012 4:15 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
That is a pretty valid idea. So, for example, making Diamonds worth more than uploading? I really like that.
1
07/19/2012 4:36 pm
Level 38 : Artisan Ninja
Stronghold257
Yes, because then you actually have to work to earn XP. Although, there are those 'blind diamonds'. That and a comment saying 'This is bad'. Always cons when there are pros :/
1
07/19/2012 4:41 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Yeah, I diamond ALOT, sometimes I diamond beforehand, but then I read, and reconsider. Most of the time, like 99/100 times, I was right to diamond.
1
07/19/2012 4:04 pm
Level 17 : Journeyman Engineer
ndnprct3
i agree!
1
07/19/2012 4:05 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Thank you :)
1
07/19/2012 4:05 pm
Level 17 : Journeyman Engineer
ndnprct3
wow! that was fast!
1
07/19/2012 4:06 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
I have nothing to do :)
1
07/19/2012 4:28 pm
Level 17 : Journeyman Engineer
ndnprct3
i agree!
23 minutes ago

thank you :)
23 minutes ago

wow! that was fast!
22 minutes ago

i have nothing to do
21 minutes ago

me:
O.O
1
07/19/2012 4:31 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
I would've got this one but the stupid comp crashed... XD
1
07/19/2012 4:00 pm
Level 44 : Master Princess
vinyl-ripp
A very well written and structured blog, and i totally agree with you. Diamond for you sir :)
1
07/19/2012 4:02 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Thank you very much!
1
07/19/2012 11:42 am
Level 39 : Artisan Creeper
11volt11
And by the way, I don't understand why BlackFTW reset his level. He in no way changed my opinion.

Before he reset his level, I thought his blogs were very good and he's creative.

Now that it is reset, I still think he's creative, but now it seems like he did that as a stunt of publicity or to seem like a better person. Now, I can't read those blogs anymore...

What he did didn't really help anyone, so it was not an act of grace, although he did make a statement. I still like him, but what he did didn't change my opinion about the leveling system at all.

What I'm trying to say is that your level is something you should feel good about. Not denounce it.
1
07/19/2012 12:04 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
BlackFTW In now way does things for publicity. He just doesn't see the need for a higher level.
1
07/19/2012 12:39 pm
Level 39 : Artisan Creeper
11volt11
...*sigh* I don't understand him...
1
07/19/2012 11:35 am
Level 39 : Artisan Creeper
11volt11
Yeah, I certainly agree that XP is rewarding. I personally think that the reason PMC is so vastly superior to the Minecraft forums is because of the leveling system. High level people become celebrated elites, and though that may sound like a bad thing, it does symbolize that their work got recognized and that they've either earned those XP's, or is a commercial expert who is highly skilled at advertising their work. I fully support the level system.

Your # 2 on reasons against leveling, the one about noobs, I actually disagree with you about. There is a distinction to be made here, between newbs and noobs. Noobs are bad. They are either new to this site and annoying and desperate, or not new and still annoying and desperate. Newbs are simply people who are new to the site. Noobs=Bad, Newbs=Usually good.
1
07/19/2012 12:06 pm
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
I understand that Newbs and Noobs are different, but just the way people say 'it's my OCD,' when they don't have OCD, I used Noobs as a way of making people understand.
1
07/19/2012 11:17 am
Level 36 : Artisan Engineer
MIKEYMK
well when somebody have less xp than others that doesnt mean hes less creative . it mean that a lot of kids were on PMC at the same time as he and they posted as much spams as it was possible so his project was pushed up to 10th page , so nobody have seen it this is why he get 0 diamonds and is unpopular
and as for popular projects . 60 % of submissions which get into reel were spams soo
anyway i dont like the xp , its ... i dont even know how to describe it . its good as long as here are not children-spamers , but the bad message is that 90 % of PMCers are children-spamers with no skills and no brain
anyway this is great blog :D , good job buddy
take a diamond
1
07/19/2012 11:25 am
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Thank you, but I must disagree. You have hit another issue.
The PMC community is not 90% Children spammers. There are other spammers too. I am a teen, only just. I'm 13.
99.5% of the 'Most popular' will be absolutely fantastic work. There are a very small minority of work that gets there that is ridiculously stupid, just spam or otherwise invalid.
The PMC community is fine. I think that is where the problem started. People were getting a little bit dramatic and started to suggest that the PMC community is 'terrible,' and the whole 'SAVE PMC' thing started. It's like fixing what's not broken. In fact, it's like fixing something that is actually one of the most functional things in the house.
I thank you for sharing your opinion.
1
07/19/2012 12:21 pm
Level 36 : Artisan Engineer
MIKEYMK
no prob man :)
1
07/19/2012 10:36 am
Level 58 : Grandmaster Demolitionist
Apimil
At last a blog about xp not made by a rant lemming. diamond and subbed.
1
07/19/2012 11:10 am
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Thank you, much appreciated.
1
07/19/2012 8:39 am
Level 24 : Expert Cake
Nyan Cat fan
I dont see the point of XP but it feels good to lv up
1
07/19/2012 6:59 am
Level 56 : Grandmaster Pixel Painter
Alpha_Legion
Eh, I'm gonna keep this short and sweet. I agree with you for most of that, and think you did a good job on this, and congrats on getting to the front page ;) Well diserved.
1
07/19/2012 9:53 am
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Thanks Alpha
1
07/19/2012 10:11 am
Level 56 : Grandmaster Pixel Painter
Alpha_Legion
np :P
1
07/19/2012 6:52 am
Level 8 : Apprentice Explorer
IhasAX
The moderator is right, but still why do we NEED/WANT xp?
1
07/19/2012 4:02 am
Level 42 : Master Lad
rageman96
I think it seems to be working as it is. It's well known that spam/stolen submissions are entered for XP, but they are taken out by the site mods, once the submission has been reported, it's only a matter of time. As for the popularity contest, well, doesn't that happen anyway? I doubt people like Disco or Block Fortress would be any less popular without the XP system, they are famous minecrafters, the XP system is simply an added bonus to them, but it does get less well-known minecrafters better known. Enter good work, and you will get popular, XP doesn't really have a factor in the matter, it just helps people to see who posts good submissions, and who doesn't. Anyway, well written blog, +1 for you.
1
07/19/2012 9:50 am
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
Thank you sir! I, at first, thought XP a terrible idea. But, I needed to look more into it, so I did, and all of the anti-blogs were ridiculous. The thing is, if you don't care about XP, don't worry about the XP. :) Thank you, once again.
1
07/19/2012 2:56 am
Level 46 : Master Architect
ricklowdis
It's just like everything else in the world. The more effort you put into it the more you get out of it. If you put effort into everyday at prime time doing an update log or bumping. You will get tons of XP,Views, and Downloads.

I see stupid projects everyday that consist of 5 cobblestone blocks and a door and have more diamonds then someone's EPIC project.

All that really matters is why you are here.

Me for instance I'm here to share my work so others may make their servers/game experience better. I'm also here to inspire others to build amazing things that will in turn inspire me.



great post even tho I see deeper into the problem and I think you are off on a few points. The real issue with the XP is it too easily manipulated. (hence why I said if you put more effort into showcasing your projects you naturally get more XP) I would say the majority of the EPIC builders/bloggers/whatevers don't really care about their level. It is important to some and it probably keeps the majority of the people coming back.
1
07/19/2012 9:52 am
Level 28 : Expert Scribe
Xamboldore
That is what I was trying to get across, thank you! However, a lot of people, despite level, do care about getting something out of it, be it XP or not.
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